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  #11  
Old   
Harry Simpson
 
Posts: n/a

Default Re: MS Sync Framework - 12-21-2007 , 11:11 AM






Thanks Ginny and Daniel,

I'm just looking to jump into use of these tools and want to make sure I'm
jumping into the right pool. Its confusing to me to say the least - Even
the Code article intermengles Sync Services for ADO.NET and Sync Framework
as if they were the same thing. The way i understand it, the only bits I
can use are Sync Services for ADO.NET v.1 which is "included in VS2008" but
when I try to find reference to this in the help it's like it doesn't exist.
Now my boss tells me that he doesn't think it will work with smart device
projects at all.
So from a Windows Mobile 5 developer standpoint none of this can be used -
correct?

I've also had a terrible head cold/flu which doesn't help either.

I'm just trying to get the big picture before I dive deeper into any
particular technology.

Thanks and Merry Christmas to all
Harry

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote

Quote:
Harry,

I haven't used the Disconnected Application Block in my code, but I am
familiar with it.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:e9iuV7oQIHA.3388 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP03 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Really would not need to connect but once at a time. The local app
would use the SDF on the device for "current" data.
Looking at the Mobile Client Application block's Disconnected Application
Block too. Every messed with that Ginny?

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:EA26A12A-01E3-4423-846B-BED968FEF706 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

Since SQL Compact supports multiple simultaneous connections to the
database from the same machine, you should be able to update the sdf
file from a separate thread or process if you use perhaps Web Services
and read/write the data yourself rather than using RDA. Sync Services
would really be ideal, but then we've discussed that already.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%237U7melQIHA.4712 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP04 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Welp I already have a RDA pull and Web service upload sync process but
it is synchronous and requires the user to wait the 11-20 seconds
required to get/give data. Happens every 5 minutes in the cradle
(Ethernet) or if wireless the user must now manually initiate.
Need a solution where the user just uses the app and the data sync is
completely transparent.
I suppose I could just wrap all that into a background thread that just
fires when it can periodically and replaces the database SDF on the
device.
Problem has always been that the SDF might be being used when the new
SDF is generated so there's got to be a smooth switch of fresh(less
stale) databgase for the more stale one.

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:CCAE978C-EAC8-4B2F-BD2F-4D1A4E09E0C8 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

I'm not completely clear myself where the lines are drawn between
Services and Framework, but it seems to need both. And you're right
that if you need to deploy pretty soon, the mobile piece isn't there
yet so you'll have to roll your own or use RDA, Merge, etc.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:e5cm3ykQIHA.1208 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP05 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Thanks Ginny
I was thinking that the Sync Services (?) was a subset and included
in VS2008 but that the Sync Framework was the bigger piece.
Apparantly if I'm developing a product for sale in the next few
months I can't use the new mobile connection bits anyhoo since they
aren't released per se.
think we need a wise wizard to direct our use of these
technologies.....as to prioritizing them.
Thanks again
Harry
"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:5A4FE2A0-5D63-4AD1-944B-69CCB6A4A391 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

The Sync Framework 1.0 is a part of VS 2008, but the new tech
preview doesn't seem to hurt that isntallation in any way as far as
I can tell in early testing. In any case, the part you're probably
most interested in - the part that includes mobile device syncing -
is still not available but will be available as a tech preview or
beta in a few months. I'm looking forward to it myself.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%232amejcQIHA.4684 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP02 (DOT) phx.gbl...
I've been looking at the MS Sync Framework today and it looks like
the next best thing in constructing data syncing between a device
and the data on a server. Started to download the Tech Preview
edition and in the instructs it tells me to uninstall any other
sync bits including Sync Services for ADO.NET. Didn't this come as
part of VS2008?
I don't want to mess up VS2008. Is this MS Sync Framework a great
thing?
Lost in the technical woods again....
Harry














Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old   
Ginny Caughey [MVP]
 
Posts: n/a

Default Re: MS Sync Framework - 12-21-2007 , 03:36 PM






Harry,

Your boss is correct for now, but this will be changing sometime in the new
year. Merry Christmas to you too! Hope you'll be feeling better soon.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote

Quote:
Thanks Ginny and Daniel,

I'm just looking to jump into use of these tools and want to make sure I'm
jumping into the right pool. Its confusing to me to say the least - Even
the Code article intermengles Sync Services for ADO.NET and Sync Framework
as if they were the same thing. The way i understand it, the only bits I
can use are Sync Services for ADO.NET v.1 which is "included in VS2008"
but when I try to find reference to this in the help it's like it doesn't
exist. Now my boss tells me that he doesn't think it will work with smart
device projects at all.
So from a Windows Mobile 5 developer standpoint none of this can be used -
correct?

I've also had a terrible head cold/flu which doesn't help either.

I'm just trying to get the big picture before I dive deeper into any
particular technology.

Thanks and Merry Christmas to all
Harry

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:3E6DD0A1-8E89-404B-9541-D9835A99E45F (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

I haven't used the Disconnected Application Block in my code, but I am
familiar with it.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:e9iuV7oQIHA.3388 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP03 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Really would not need to connect but once at a time. The local app
would use the SDF on the device for "current" data.
Looking at the Mobile Client Application block's Disconnected
Application Block too. Every messed with that Ginny?

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:EA26A12A-01E3-4423-846B-BED968FEF706 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

Since SQL Compact supports multiple simultaneous connections to the
database from the same machine, you should be able to update the sdf
file from a separate thread or process if you use perhaps Web Services
and read/write the data yourself rather than using RDA. Sync Services
would really be ideal, but then we've discussed that already.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%237U7melQIHA.4712 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP04 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Welp I already have a RDA pull and Web service upload sync process but
it is synchronous and requires the user to wait the 11-20 seconds
required to get/give data. Happens every 5 minutes in the cradle
(Ethernet) or if wireless the user must now manually initiate.
Need a solution where the user just uses the app and the data sync is
completely transparent.
I suppose I could just wrap all that into a background thread that
just fires when it can periodically and replaces the database SDF on
the device.
Problem has always been that the SDF might be being used when the new
SDF is generated so there's got to be a smooth switch of fresh(less
stale) databgase for the more stale one.

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:CCAE978C-EAC8-4B2F-BD2F-4D1A4E09E0C8 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

I'm not completely clear myself where the lines are drawn between
Services and Framework, but it seems to need both. And you're right
that if you need to deploy pretty soon, the mobile piece isn't there
yet so you'll have to roll your own or use RDA, Merge, etc.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:e5cm3ykQIHA.1208 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP05 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Thanks Ginny
I was thinking that the Sync Services (?) was a subset and included
in VS2008 but that the Sync Framework was the bigger piece.
Apparantly if I'm developing a product for sale in the next few
months I can't use the new mobile connection bits anyhoo since they
aren't released per se.
think we need a wise wizard to direct our use of these
technologies.....as to prioritizing them.
Thanks again
Harry
"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:5A4FE2A0-5D63-4AD1-944B-69CCB6A4A391 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

The Sync Framework 1.0 is a part of VS 2008, but the new tech
preview doesn't seem to hurt that isntallation in any way as far as
I can tell in early testing. In any case, the part you're probably
most interested in - the part that includes mobile device syncing -
is still not available but will be available as a tech preview or
beta in a few months. I'm looking forward to it myself.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%232amejcQIHA.4684 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP02 (DOT) phx.gbl...
I've been looking at the MS Sync Framework today and it looks like
the next best thing in constructing data syncing between a device
and the data on a server. Started to download the Tech Preview
edition and in the instructs it tells me to uninstall any other
sync bits including Sync Services for ADO.NET. Didn't this come
as part of VS2008?
I don't want to mess up VS2008. Is this MS Sync Framework a great
thing?
Lost in the technical woods again....
Harry















Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old   
Harry Simpson
 
Posts: n/a

Default Re: MS Sync Framework - 12-27-2007 , 09:53 AM



Thanks Ginny,
Barely survived.....
I'll put this on hold and see what comes about. Guess for now I can just try
to move the whole sync that I'm already doing to a background thread. And
suppose it would be possible to copy the recently synced SDF over the
existing one on the device in a split second right?

So the app may be calling the stale database and then after syncing in the
background thread I just copy one SDF (just synced) over the working one the
app uses? Is this what most are doing now?

Thanks!!
Harry

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote

Quote:
Harry,

Your boss is correct for now, but this will be changing sometime in the
new year. Merry Christmas to you too! Hope you'll be feeling better soon.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%23BMF0w%23QIHA.1188 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP04 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Thanks Ginny and Daniel,

I'm just looking to jump into use of these tools and want to make sure
I'm jumping into the right pool. Its confusing to me to say the least -
Even the Code article intermengles Sync Services for ADO.NET and Sync
Framework as if they were the same thing. The way i understand it, the
only bits I can use are Sync Services for ADO.NET v.1 which is "included
in VS2008" but when I try to find reference to this in the help it's like
it doesn't exist. Now my boss tells me that he doesn't think it will work
with smart device projects at all.
So from a Windows Mobile 5 developer standpoint none of this can be
used - correct?

I've also had a terrible head cold/flu which doesn't help either.

I'm just trying to get the big picture before I dive deeper into any
particular technology.

Thanks and Merry Christmas to all
Harry

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:3E6DD0A1-8E89-404B-9541-D9835A99E45F (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

I haven't used the Disconnected Application Block in my code, but I am
familiar with it.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:e9iuV7oQIHA.3388 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP03 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Really would not need to connect but once at a time. The local app
would use the SDF on the device for "current" data.
Looking at the Mobile Client Application block's Disconnected
Application Block too. Every messed with that Ginny?

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:EA26A12A-01E3-4423-846B-BED968FEF706 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

Since SQL Compact supports multiple simultaneous connections to the
database from the same machine, you should be able to update the sdf
file from a separate thread or process if you use perhaps Web Services
and read/write the data yourself rather than using RDA. Sync Services
would really be ideal, but then we've discussed that already.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%237U7melQIHA.4712 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP04 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Welp I already have a RDA pull and Web service upload sync process
but it is synchronous and requires the user to wait the 11-20 seconds
required to get/give data. Happens every 5 minutes in the cradle
(Ethernet) or if wireless the user must now manually initiate.
Need a solution where the user just uses the app and the data sync is
completely transparent.
I suppose I could just wrap all that into a background thread that
just fires when it can periodically and replaces the database SDF on
the device.
Problem has always been that the SDF might be being used when the new
SDF is generated so there's got to be a smooth switch of fresh(less
stale) databgase for the more stale one.

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:CCAE978C-EAC8-4B2F-BD2F-4D1A4E09E0C8 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

I'm not completely clear myself where the lines are drawn between
Services and Framework, but it seems to need both. And you're right
that if you need to deploy pretty soon, the mobile piece isn't there
yet so you'll have to roll your own or use RDA, Merge, etc.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:e5cm3ykQIHA.1208 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP05 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Thanks Ginny
I was thinking that the Sync Services (?) was a subset and included
in VS2008 but that the Sync Framework was the bigger piece.
Apparantly if I'm developing a product for sale in the next few
months I can't use the new mobile connection bits anyhoo since they
aren't released per se.
think we need a wise wizard to direct our use of these
technologies.....as to prioritizing them.
Thanks again
Harry
"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote
in message
news:5A4FE2A0-5D63-4AD1-944B-69CCB6A4A391 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

The Sync Framework 1.0 is a part of VS 2008, but the new tech
preview doesn't seem to hurt that isntallation in any way as far
as I can tell in early testing. In any case, the part you're
probably most interested in - the part that includes mobile device
syncing - is still not available but will be available as a tech
preview or beta in a few months. I'm looking forward to it myself.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%232amejcQIHA.4684 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP02 (DOT) phx.gbl...
I've been looking at the MS Sync Framework today and it looks
like the next best thing in constructing data syncing between a
device and the data on a server. Started to download the Tech
Preview edition and in the instructs it tells me to uninstall any
other sync bits including Sync Services for ADO.NET. Didn't this
come as part of VS2008?
I don't want to mess up VS2008. Is this MS Sync Framework a
great thing?
Lost in the technical woods again....
Harry

















Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old   
Ginny Caughey [MVP]
 
Posts: n/a

Default Re: MS Sync Framework - 12-27-2007 , 10:03 AM



Harry,

The only problem I see with that plan would be if the SDF file you want to
replace is in use by another thread, but probably you've already thought of
that.

I think in practice people are using a variety of syncing techniques
depending on the situation.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote

Quote:
Thanks Ginny,
Barely survived.....
I'll put this on hold and see what comes about. Guess for now I can just
try to move the whole sync that I'm already doing to a background thread.
And suppose it would be possible to copy the recently synced SDF over the
existing one on the device in a split second right?

So the app may be calling the stale database and then after syncing in the
background thread I just copy one SDF (just synced) over the working one
the app uses? Is this what most are doing now?

Thanks!!
Harry

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:3B81B8FB-C7DB-42A1-A4F0-31306F0E68A7 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

Your boss is correct for now, but this will be changing sometime in the
new year. Merry Christmas to you too! Hope you'll be feeling better soon.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%23BMF0w%23QIHA.1188 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP04 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Thanks Ginny and Daniel,

I'm just looking to jump into use of these tools and want to make sure
I'm jumping into the right pool. Its confusing to me to say the least -
Even the Code article intermengles Sync Services for ADO.NET and Sync
Framework as if they were the same thing. The way i understand it, the
only bits I can use are Sync Services for ADO.NET v.1 which is "included
in VS2008" but when I try to find reference to this in the help it's
like it doesn't exist. Now my boss tells me that he doesn't think it
will work with smart device projects at all.
So from a Windows Mobile 5 developer standpoint none of this can be
used - correct?

I've also had a terrible head cold/flu which doesn't help either.

I'm just trying to get the big picture before I dive deeper into any
particular technology.

Thanks and Merry Christmas to all
Harry

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:3E6DD0A1-8E89-404B-9541-D9835A99E45F (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

I haven't used the Disconnected Application Block in my code, but I am
familiar with it.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:e9iuV7oQIHA.3388 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP03 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Really would not need to connect but once at a time. The local app
would use the SDF on the device for "current" data.
Looking at the Mobile Client Application block's Disconnected
Application Block too. Every messed with that Ginny?

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:EA26A12A-01E3-4423-846B-BED968FEF706 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

Since SQL Compact supports multiple simultaneous connections to the
database from the same machine, you should be able to update the sdf
file from a separate thread or process if you use perhaps Web
Services and read/write the data yourself rather than using RDA. Sync
Services would really be ideal, but then we've discussed that
already.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%237U7melQIHA.4712 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP04 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Welp I already have a RDA pull and Web service upload sync process
but it is synchronous and requires the user to wait the 11-20
seconds required to get/give data. Happens every 5 minutes in the
cradle (Ethernet) or if wireless the user must now manually
initiate.
Need a solution where the user just uses the app and the data sync
is completely transparent.
I suppose I could just wrap all that into a background thread that
just fires when it can periodically and replaces the database SDF on
the device.
Problem has always been that the SDF might be being used when the
new SDF is generated so there's got to be a smooth switch of
fresh(less stale) databgase for the more stale one.

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:CCAE978C-EAC8-4B2F-BD2F-4D1A4E09E0C8 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

I'm not completely clear myself where the lines are drawn between
Services and Framework, but it seems to need both. And you're right
that if you need to deploy pretty soon, the mobile piece isn't
there yet so you'll have to roll your own or use RDA, Merge, etc.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:e5cm3ykQIHA.1208 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP05 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Thanks Ginny
I was thinking that the Sync Services (?) was a subset and
included in VS2008 but that the Sync Framework was the bigger
piece. Apparantly if I'm developing a product for sale in the next
few months I can't use the new mobile connection bits anyhoo since
they aren't released per se.
think we need a wise wizard to direct our use of these
technologies.....as to prioritizing them.
Thanks again
Harry
"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote
in message
news:5A4FE2A0-5D63-4AD1-944B-69CCB6A4A391 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

The Sync Framework 1.0 is a part of VS 2008, but the new tech
preview doesn't seem to hurt that isntallation in any way as far
as I can tell in early testing. In any case, the part you're
probably most interested in - the part that includes mobile
device syncing - is still not available but will be available as
a tech preview or beta in a few months. I'm looking forward to it
myself.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%232amejcQIHA.4684 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP02 (DOT) phx.gbl...
I've been looking at the MS Sync Framework today and it looks
like the next best thing in constructing data syncing between a
device and the data on a server. Started to download the Tech
Preview edition and in the instructs it tells me to uninstall
any other sync bits including Sync Services for ADO.NET. Didn't
this come as part of VS2008?
I don't want to mess up VS2008. Is this MS Sync Framework a
great thing?
Lost in the technical woods again....
Harry


















Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old   
Harry Simpson
 
Posts: n/a

Default Re: MS Sync Framework - 12-27-2007 , 11:15 AM



That's "the problem" partially solved by at least just updating a separate
SDF database which is the duplicate of the working one the app is actually
using.
The trick would be to "copy" the updated one over the working one in a
locked fashion.

Anyone doing this?

Harry

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote

Quote:
Harry,

The only problem I see with that plan would be if the SDF file you want to
replace is in use by another thread, but probably you've already thought
of that.

I think in practice people are using a variety of syncing techniques
depending on the situation.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:OU8ExgJSIHA.4128 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP06 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Thanks Ginny,
Barely survived.....
I'll put this on hold and see what comes about. Guess for now I can just
try to move the whole sync that I'm already doing to a background thread.
And suppose it would be possible to copy the recently synced SDF over the
existing one on the device in a split second right?

So the app may be calling the stale database and then after syncing in
the background thread I just copy one SDF (just synced) over the working
one the app uses? Is this what most are doing now?

Thanks!!
Harry

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:3B81B8FB-C7DB-42A1-A4F0-31306F0E68A7 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

Your boss is correct for now, but this will be changing sometime in the
new year. Merry Christmas to you too! Hope you'll be feeling better
soon.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%23BMF0w%23QIHA.1188 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP04 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Thanks Ginny and Daniel,

I'm just looking to jump into use of these tools and want to make sure
I'm jumping into the right pool. Its confusing to me to say the
least - Even the Code article intermengles Sync Services for ADO.NET
and Sync Framework as if they were the same thing. The way i
understand it, the only bits I can use are Sync Services for ADO.NET
v.1 which is "included in VS2008" but when I try to find reference to
this in the help it's like it doesn't exist. Now my boss tells me that
he doesn't think it will work with smart device projects at all.
So from a Windows Mobile 5 developer standpoint none of this can be
used - correct?

I've also had a terrible head cold/flu which doesn't help either.

I'm just trying to get the big picture before I dive deeper into any
particular technology.

Thanks and Merry Christmas to all
Harry

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:3E6DD0A1-8E89-404B-9541-D9835A99E45F (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

I haven't used the Disconnected Application Block in my code, but I am
familiar with it.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:e9iuV7oQIHA.3388 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP03 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Really would not need to connect but once at a time. The local app
would use the SDF on the device for "current" data.
Looking at the Mobile Client Application block's Disconnected
Application Block too. Every messed with that Ginny?

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:EA26A12A-01E3-4423-846B-BED968FEF706 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

Since SQL Compact supports multiple simultaneous connections to the
database from the same machine, you should be able to update the sdf
file from a separate thread or process if you use perhaps Web
Services and read/write the data yourself rather than using RDA.
Sync Services would really be ideal, but then we've discussed that
already.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%237U7melQIHA.4712 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP04 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Welp I already have a RDA pull and Web service upload sync process
but it is synchronous and requires the user to wait the 11-20
seconds required to get/give data. Happens every 5 minutes in the
cradle (Ethernet) or if wireless the user must now manually
initiate.
Need a solution where the user just uses the app and the data sync
is completely transparent.
I suppose I could just wrap all that into a background thread that
just fires when it can periodically and replaces the database SDF
on the device.
Problem has always been that the SDF might be being used when the
new SDF is generated so there's got to be a smooth switch of
fresh(less stale) databgase for the more stale one.

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote
in message
news:CCAE978C-EAC8-4B2F-BD2F-4D1A4E09E0C8 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

I'm not completely clear myself where the lines are drawn between
Services and Framework, but it seems to need both. And you're
right that if you need to deploy pretty soon, the mobile piece
isn't there yet so you'll have to roll your own or use RDA, Merge,
etc.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:e5cm3ykQIHA.1208 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP05 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Thanks Ginny
I was thinking that the Sync Services (?) was a subset and
included in VS2008 but that the Sync Framework was the bigger
piece. Apparantly if I'm developing a product for sale in the
next few months I can't use the new mobile connection bits anyhoo
since they aren't released per se.
think we need a wise wizard to direct our use of these
technologies.....as to prioritizing them.
Thanks again
Harry
"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote
in message
news:5A4FE2A0-5D63-4AD1-944B-69CCB6A4A391 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

The Sync Framework 1.0 is a part of VS 2008, but the new tech
preview doesn't seem to hurt that isntallation in any way as far
as I can tell in early testing. In any case, the part you're
probably most interested in - the part that includes mobile
device syncing - is still not available but will be available as
a tech preview or beta in a few months. I'm looking forward to
it myself.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%232amejcQIHA.4684 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP02 (DOT) phx.gbl...
I've been looking at the MS Sync Framework today and it looks
like the next best thing in constructing data syncing between a
device and the data on a server. Started to download the Tech
Preview edition and in the instructs it tells me to uninstall
any other sync bits including Sync Services for ADO.NET.
Didn't this come as part of VS2008?
I don't want to mess up VS2008. Is this MS Sync Framework a
great thing?
Lost in the technical woods again....
Harry




















Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old   
Ginny Caughey [MVP]
 
Posts: n/a

Default Re: MS Sync Framework - 12-27-2007 , 11:23 AM



Harry,

The only way I can see to update the database already in use would be to
write code that determines when a row needed updating, similar to what the
Sync Framework does under the covers using a TimeStamp or LastEditDate
column.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote

Quote:
That's "the problem" partially solved by at least just updating a
separate SDF database which is the duplicate of the working one the app is
actually using.
The trick would be to "copy" the updated one over the working one in a
locked fashion.

Anyone doing this?

Harry

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:BEA220F1-92BB-4CFD-83DA-F0332A3BA6E7 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

The only problem I see with that plan would be if the SDF file you want
to replace is in use by another thread, but probably you've already
thought of that.

I think in practice people are using a variety of syncing techniques
depending on the situation.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:OU8ExgJSIHA.4128 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP06 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Thanks Ginny,
Barely survived.....
I'll put this on hold and see what comes about. Guess for now I can just
try to move the whole sync that I'm already doing to a background
thread. And suppose it would be possible to copy the recently synced SDF
over the existing one on the device in a split second right?

So the app may be calling the stale database and then after syncing in
the background thread I just copy one SDF (just synced) over the working
one the app uses? Is this what most are doing now?

Thanks!!
Harry

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:3B81B8FB-C7DB-42A1-A4F0-31306F0E68A7 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

Your boss is correct for now, but this will be changing sometime in the
new year. Merry Christmas to you too! Hope you'll be feeling better
soon.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%23BMF0w%23QIHA.1188 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP04 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Thanks Ginny and Daniel,

I'm just looking to jump into use of these tools and want to make sure
I'm jumping into the right pool. Its confusing to me to say the
least - Even the Code article intermengles Sync Services for ADO.NET
and Sync Framework as if they were the same thing. The way i
understand it, the only bits I can use are Sync Services for ADO.NET
v.1 which is "included in VS2008" but when I try to find reference to
this in the help it's like it doesn't exist. Now my boss tells me that
he doesn't think it will work with smart device projects at all.
So from a Windows Mobile 5 developer standpoint none of this can be
used - correct?

I've also had a terrible head cold/flu which doesn't help either.

I'm just trying to get the big picture before I dive deeper into any
particular technology.

Thanks and Merry Christmas to all
Harry

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:3E6DD0A1-8E89-404B-9541-D9835A99E45F (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

I haven't used the Disconnected Application Block in my code, but I
am familiar with it.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:e9iuV7oQIHA.3388 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP03 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Really would not need to connect but once at a time. The local app
would use the SDF on the device for "current" data.
Looking at the Mobile Client Application block's Disconnected
Application Block too. Every messed with that Ginny?

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:EA26A12A-01E3-4423-846B-BED968FEF706 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

Since SQL Compact supports multiple simultaneous connections to the
database from the same machine, you should be able to update the
sdf file from a separate thread or process if you use perhaps Web
Services and read/write the data yourself rather than using RDA.
Sync Services would really be ideal, but then we've discussed that
already.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%237U7melQIHA.4712 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP04 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Welp I already have a RDA pull and Web service upload sync process
but it is synchronous and requires the user to wait the 11-20
seconds required to get/give data. Happens every 5 minutes in the
cradle (Ethernet) or if wireless the user must now manually
initiate.
Need a solution where the user just uses the app and the data sync
is completely transparent.
I suppose I could just wrap all that into a background thread that
just fires when it can periodically and replaces the database SDF
on the device.
Problem has always been that the SDF might be being used when the
new SDF is generated so there's got to be a smooth switch of
fresh(less stale) databgase for the more stale one.

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote
in message
news:CCAE978C-EAC8-4B2F-BD2F-4D1A4E09E0C8 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

I'm not completely clear myself where the lines are drawn between
Services and Framework, but it seems to need both. And you're
right that if you need to deploy pretty soon, the mobile piece
isn't there yet so you'll have to roll your own or use RDA,
Merge, etc.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:e5cm3ykQIHA.1208 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP05 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Thanks Ginny
I was thinking that the Sync Services (?) was a subset and
included in VS2008 but that the Sync Framework was the bigger
piece. Apparantly if I'm developing a product for sale in the
next few months I can't use the new mobile connection bits
anyhoo since they aren't released per se.
think we need a wise wizard to direct our use of these
technologies.....as to prioritizing them.
Thanks again
Harry
"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com
wrote in message
news:5A4FE2A0-5D63-4AD1-944B-69CCB6A4A391 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

The Sync Framework 1.0 is a part of VS 2008, but the new tech
preview doesn't seem to hurt that isntallation in any way as
far as I can tell in early testing. In any case, the part
you're probably most interested in - the part that includes
mobile device syncing - is still not available but will be
available as a tech preview or beta in a few months. I'm
looking forward to it myself.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%232amejcQIHA.4684 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP02 (DOT) phx.gbl...
I've been looking at the MS Sync Framework today and it looks
like the next best thing in constructing data syncing between
a device and the data on a server. Started to download the
Tech Preview edition and in the instructs it tells me to
uninstall any other sync bits including Sync Services for
ADO.NET. Didn't this come as part of VS2008?
I don't want to mess up VS2008. Is this MS Sync Framework a
great thing?
Lost in the technical woods again....
Harry





















Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old   
Harry Simpson
 
Posts: n/a

Default Re: MS Sync Framework - 12-27-2007 , 11:52 AM



Ginny,

Could you not "lock the app" in some way and simply make the IO copy of the
one SDF over the other SDF on the device. Just copy the updated database
into the active directory where the SDF the app actually hits is located?

Harry

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote

Quote:
Harry,

The only way I can see to update the database already in use would be to
write code that determines when a row needed updating, similar to what the
Sync Framework does under the covers using a TimeStamp or LastEditDate
column.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:O1puiOKSIHA.280 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP03 (DOT) phx.gbl...
That's "the problem" partially solved by at least just updating a
separate SDF database which is the duplicate of the working one the app
is actually using.
The trick would be to "copy" the updated one over the working one in a
locked fashion.

Anyone doing this?

Harry

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:BEA220F1-92BB-4CFD-83DA-F0332A3BA6E7 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

The only problem I see with that plan would be if the SDF file you want
to replace is in use by another thread, but probably you've already
thought of that.

I think in practice people are using a variety of syncing techniques
depending on the situation.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:OU8ExgJSIHA.4128 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP06 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Thanks Ginny,
Barely survived.....
I'll put this on hold and see what comes about. Guess for now I can
just try to move the whole sync that I'm already doing to a background
thread. And suppose it would be possible to copy the recently synced
SDF over the existing one on the device in a split second right?

So the app may be calling the stale database and then after syncing in
the background thread I just copy one SDF (just synced) over the
working one the app uses? Is this what most are doing now?

Thanks!!
Harry

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:3B81B8FB-C7DB-42A1-A4F0-31306F0E68A7 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

Your boss is correct for now, but this will be changing sometime in
the new year. Merry Christmas to you too! Hope you'll be feeling
better soon.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%23BMF0w%23QIHA.1188 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP04 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Thanks Ginny and Daniel,

I'm just looking to jump into use of these tools and want to make
sure I'm jumping into the right pool. Its confusing to me to say the
least - Even the Code article intermengles Sync Services for ADO.NET
and Sync Framework as if they were the same thing. The way i
understand it, the only bits I can use are Sync Services for ADO.NET
v.1 which is "included in VS2008" but when I try to find reference to
this in the help it's like it doesn't exist. Now my boss tells me
that he doesn't think it will work with smart device projects at all.
So from a Windows Mobile 5 developer standpoint none of this can be
used - correct?

I've also had a terrible head cold/flu which doesn't help either.

I'm just trying to get the big picture before I dive deeper into any
particular technology.

Thanks and Merry Christmas to all
Harry

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:3E6DD0A1-8E89-404B-9541-D9835A99E45F (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

I haven't used the Disconnected Application Block in my code, but I
am familiar with it.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:e9iuV7oQIHA.3388 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP03 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Really would not need to connect but once at a time. The local
app would use the SDF on the device for "current" data.
Looking at the Mobile Client Application block's Disconnected
Application Block too. Every messed with that Ginny?

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote
in message
news:EA26A12A-01E3-4423-846B-BED968FEF706 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

Since SQL Compact supports multiple simultaneous connections to
the database from the same machine, you should be able to update
the sdf file from a separate thread or process if you use perhaps
Web Services and read/write the data yourself rather than using
RDA. Sync Services would really be ideal, but then we've discussed
that already.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%237U7melQIHA.4712 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP04 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Welp I already have a RDA pull and Web service upload sync
process but it is synchronous and requires the user to wait the
11-20 seconds required to get/give data. Happens every 5 minutes
in the cradle (Ethernet) or if wireless the user must now
manually initiate.
Need a solution where the user just uses the app and the data
sync is completely transparent.
I suppose I could just wrap all that into a background thread
that just fires when it can periodically and replaces the
database SDF on the device.
Problem has always been that the SDF might be being used when the
new SDF is generated so there's got to be a smooth switch of
fresh(less stale) databgase for the more stale one.

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote
in message
news:CCAE978C-EAC8-4B2F-BD2F-4D1A4E09E0C8 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

I'm not completely clear myself where the lines are drawn
between Services and Framework, but it seems to need both. And
you're right that if you need to deploy pretty soon, the mobile
piece isn't there yet so you'll have to roll your own or use
RDA, Merge, etc.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:e5cm3ykQIHA.1208 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP05 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Thanks Ginny
I was thinking that the Sync Services (?) was a subset and
included in VS2008 but that the Sync Framework was the bigger
piece. Apparantly if I'm developing a product for sale in the
next few months I can't use the new mobile connection bits
anyhoo since they aren't released per se.
think we need a wise wizard to direct our use of these
technologies.....as to prioritizing them.
Thanks again
Harry
"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com
wrote in message
news:5A4FE2A0-5D63-4AD1-944B-69CCB6A4A391 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

The Sync Framework 1.0 is a part of VS 2008, but the new tech
preview doesn't seem to hurt that isntallation in any way as
far as I can tell in early testing. In any case, the part
you're probably most interested in - the part that includes
mobile device syncing - is still not available but will be
available as a tech preview or beta in a few months. I'm
looking forward to it myself.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%232amejcQIHA.4684 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP02 (DOT) phx.gbl...
I've been looking at the MS Sync Framework today and it looks
like the next best thing in constructing data syncing between
a device and the data on a server. Started to download the
Tech Preview edition and in the instructs it tells me to
uninstall any other sync bits including Sync Services for
ADO.NET. Didn't this come as part of VS2008?
I don't want to mess up VS2008. Is this MS Sync Framework a
great thing?
Lost in the technical woods again....
Harry























Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old   
Ginny Caughey [MVP]
 
Posts: n/a

Default Re: MS Sync Framework - 12-27-2007 , 12:00 PM



Harry,

Well yes I guess you could but since I haven't done it I couldn't recommend
the exact best way to do it. I tend to think more along the lines of
multi-user access to the same data rather than somehow locking one user out
while another does an update, but just because my brain is prejudiced that
doesn't mean it's necessarily the best approach here.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote

Quote:
Ginny,

Could you not "lock the app" in some way and simply make the IO copy of
the one SDF over the other SDF on the device. Just copy the updated
database into the active directory where the SDF the app actually hits is
located?

Harry

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:994EDE78-E699-4704-BAC2-1D0BEF347632 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

The only way I can see to update the database already in use would be to
write code that determines when a row needed updating, similar to what
the Sync Framework does under the covers using a TimeStamp or
LastEditDate column.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:O1puiOKSIHA.280 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP03 (DOT) phx.gbl...
That's "the problem" partially solved by at least just updating a
separate SDF database which is the duplicate of the working one the app
is actually using.
The trick would be to "copy" the updated one over the working one in a
locked fashion.

Anyone doing this?

Harry

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:BEA220F1-92BB-4CFD-83DA-F0332A3BA6E7 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

The only problem I see with that plan would be if the SDF file you want
to replace is in use by another thread, but probably you've already
thought of that.

I think in practice people are using a variety of syncing techniques
depending on the situation.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:OU8ExgJSIHA.4128 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP06 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Thanks Ginny,
Barely survived.....
I'll put this on hold and see what comes about. Guess for now I can
just try to move the whole sync that I'm already doing to a background
thread. And suppose it would be possible to copy the recently synced
SDF over the existing one on the device in a split second right?

So the app may be calling the stale database and then after syncing in
the background thread I just copy one SDF (just synced) over the
working one the app uses? Is this what most are doing now?

Thanks!!
Harry

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:3B81B8FB-C7DB-42A1-A4F0-31306F0E68A7 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

Your boss is correct for now, but this will be changing sometime in
the new year. Merry Christmas to you too! Hope you'll be feeling
better soon.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%23BMF0w%23QIHA.1188 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP04 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Thanks Ginny and Daniel,

I'm just looking to jump into use of these tools and want to make
sure I'm jumping into the right pool. Its confusing to me to say
the least - Even the Code article intermengles Sync Services for
ADO.NET and Sync Framework as if they were the same thing. The way
i understand it, the only bits I can use are Sync Services for
ADO.NET v.1 which is "included in VS2008" but when I try to find
reference to this in the help it's like it doesn't exist. Now my
boss tells me that he doesn't think it will work with smart device
projects at all.
So from a Windows Mobile 5 developer standpoint none of this can be
used - correct?

I've also had a terrible head cold/flu which doesn't help either.

I'm just trying to get the big picture before I dive deeper into any
particular technology.

Thanks and Merry Christmas to all
Harry

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:3E6DD0A1-8E89-404B-9541-D9835A99E45F (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

I haven't used the Disconnected Application Block in my code, but I
am familiar with it.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:e9iuV7oQIHA.3388 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP03 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Really would not need to connect but once at a time. The local
app would use the SDF on the device for "current" data.
Looking at the Mobile Client Application block's Disconnected
Application Block too. Every messed with that Ginny?

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote
in message
news:EA26A12A-01E3-4423-846B-BED968FEF706 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

Since SQL Compact supports multiple simultaneous connections to
the database from the same machine, you should be able to update
the sdf file from a separate thread or process if you use perhaps
Web Services and read/write the data yourself rather than using
RDA. Sync Services would really be ideal, but then we've
discussed that already.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%237U7melQIHA.4712 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP04 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Welp I already have a RDA pull and Web service upload sync
process but it is synchronous and requires the user to wait the
11-20 seconds required to get/give data. Happens every 5 minutes
in the cradle (Ethernet) or if wireless the user must now
manually initiate.
Need a solution where the user just uses the app and the data
sync is completely transparent.
I suppose I could just wrap all that into a background thread
that just fires when it can periodically and replaces the
database SDF on the device.
Problem has always been that the SDF might be being used when
the new SDF is generated so there's got to be a smooth switch of
fresh(less stale) databgase for the more stale one.

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com
wrote in message
news:CCAE978C-EAC8-4B2F-BD2F-4D1A4E09E0C8 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

I'm not completely clear myself where the lines are drawn
between Services and Framework, but it seems to need both. And
you're right that if you need to deploy pretty soon, the mobile
piece isn't there yet so you'll have to roll your own or use
RDA, Merge, etc.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:e5cm3ykQIHA.1208 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP05 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Thanks Ginny
I was thinking that the Sync Services (?) was a subset and
included in VS2008 but that the Sync Framework was the bigger
piece. Apparantly if I'm developing a product for sale in the
next few months I can't use the new mobile connection bits
anyhoo since they aren't released per se.
think we need a wise wizard to direct our use of these
technologies.....as to prioritizing them.
Thanks again
Harry
"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com
wrote in message
news:5A4FE2A0-5D63-4AD1-944B-69CCB6A4A391 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

The Sync Framework 1.0 is a part of VS 2008, but the new tech
preview doesn't seem to hurt that isntallation in any way as
far as I can tell in early testing. In any case, the part
you're probably most interested in - the part that includes
mobile device syncing - is still not available but will be
available as a tech preview or beta in a few months. I'm
looking forward to it myself.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%232amejcQIHA.4684 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP02 (DOT) phx.gbl...
I've been looking at the MS Sync Framework today and it
looks like the next best thing in constructing data syncing
between a device and the data on a server. Started to
download the Tech Preview edition and in the instructs it
tells me to uninstall any other sync bits including Sync
Services for ADO.NET. Didn't this come as part of VS2008?
I don't want to mess up VS2008. Is this MS Sync Framework a
great thing?
Lost in the technical woods again....
Harry
























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  #19  
Old   
Harry Simpson
 
Posts: n/a

Default Re: MS Sync Framework - 12-27-2007 , 02:07 PM



For the most part I'd just be doing a RDA PULL - the only uploading would be
logs via Web service.

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote

Quote:
Harry,

Well yes I guess you could but since I haven't done it I couldn't
recommend the exact best way to do it. I tend to think more along the
lines of multi-user access to the same data rather than somehow locking
one user out while another does an update, but just because my brain is
prejudiced that doesn't mean it's necessarily the best approach here.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:O7gUdjKSIHA.4684 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP02 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Ginny,

Could you not "lock the app" in some way and simply make the IO copy of
the one SDF over the other SDF on the device. Just copy the updated
database into the active directory where the SDF the app actually hits is
located?

Harry

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:994EDE78-E699-4704-BAC2-1D0BEF347632 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

The only way I can see to update the database already in use would be to
write code that determines when a row needed updating, similar to what
the Sync Framework does under the covers using a TimeStamp or
LastEditDate column.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:O1puiOKSIHA.280 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP03 (DOT) phx.gbl...
That's "the problem" partially solved by at least just updating a
separate SDF database which is the duplicate of the working one the app
is actually using.
The trick would be to "copy" the updated one over the working one in a
locked fashion.

Anyone doing this?

Harry

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:BEA220F1-92BB-4CFD-83DA-F0332A3BA6E7 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

The only problem I see with that plan would be if the SDF file you
want to replace is in use by another thread, but probably you've
already thought of that.

I think in practice people are using a variety of syncing techniques
depending on the situation.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:OU8ExgJSIHA.4128 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP06 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Thanks Ginny,
Barely survived.....
I'll put this on hold and see what comes about. Guess for now I can
just try to move the whole sync that I'm already doing to a
background thread. And suppose it would be possible to copy the
recently synced SDF over the existing one on the device in a split
second right?

So the app may be calling the stale database and then after syncing
in the background thread I just copy one SDF (just synced) over the
working one the app uses? Is this what most are doing now?

Thanks!!
Harry

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote in
message news:3B81B8FB-C7DB-42A1-A4F0-31306F0E68A7 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

Your boss is correct for now, but this will be changing sometime in
the new year. Merry Christmas to you too! Hope you'll be feeling
better soon.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%23BMF0w%23QIHA.1188 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP04 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Thanks Ginny and Daniel,

I'm just looking to jump into use of these tools and want to make
sure I'm jumping into the right pool. Its confusing to me to say
the least - Even the Code article intermengles Sync Services for
ADO.NET and Sync Framework as if they were the same thing. The way
i understand it, the only bits I can use are Sync Services for
ADO.NET v.1 which is "included in VS2008" but when I try to find
reference to this in the help it's like it doesn't exist. Now my
boss tells me that he doesn't think it will work with smart device
projects at all.
So from a Windows Mobile 5 developer standpoint none of this can be
used - correct?

I've also had a terrible head cold/flu which doesn't help either.

I'm just trying to get the big picture before I dive deeper into
any particular technology.

Thanks and Merry Christmas to all
Harry

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote
in message
news:3E6DD0A1-8E89-404B-9541-D9835A99E45F (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

I haven't used the Disconnected Application Block in my code, but
I am familiar with it.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:e9iuV7oQIHA.3388 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP03 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Really would not need to connect but once at a time. The local
app would use the SDF on the device for "current" data.
Looking at the Mobile Client Application block's Disconnected
Application Block too. Every messed with that Ginny?

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com> wrote
in message
news:EA26A12A-01E3-4423-846B-BED968FEF706 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

Since SQL Compact supports multiple simultaneous connections to
the database from the same machine, you should be able to update
the sdf file from a separate thread or process if you use
perhaps Web Services and read/write the data yourself rather
than using RDA. Sync Services would really be ideal, but then
we've discussed that already.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%237U7melQIHA.4712 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP04 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Welp I already have a RDA pull and Web service upload sync
process but it is synchronous and requires the user to wait the
11-20 seconds required to get/give data. Happens every 5
minutes in the cradle (Ethernet) or if wireless the user must
now manually initiate.
Need a solution where the user just uses the app and the data
sync is completely transparent.
I suppose I could just wrap all that into a background thread
that just fires when it can periodically and replaces the
database SDF on the device.
Problem has always been that the SDF might be being used when
the new SDF is generated so there's got to be a smooth switch
of fresh(less stale) databgase for the more stale one.

"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com
wrote in message
news:CCAE978C-EAC8-4B2F-BD2F-4D1A4E09E0C8 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

I'm not completely clear myself where the lines are drawn
between Services and Framework, but it seems to need both. And
you're right that if you need to deploy pretty soon, the
mobile piece isn't there yet so you'll have to roll your own
or use RDA, Merge, etc.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:e5cm3ykQIHA.1208 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP05 (DOT) phx.gbl...
Thanks Ginny
I was thinking that the Sync Services (?) was a subset and
included in VS2008 but that the Sync Framework was the bigger
piece. Apparantly if I'm developing a product for sale in the
next few months I can't use the new mobile connection bits
anyhoo since they aren't released per se.
think we need a wise wizard to direct our use of these
technologies.....as to prioritizing them.
Thanks again
Harry
"Ginny Caughey [MVP]" <ginny.caughey.online (AT) wasteworks (DOT) com
wrote in message
news:5A4FE2A0-5D63-4AD1-944B-69CCB6A4A391 (AT) microsoft (DOT) com...
Harry,

The Sync Framework 1.0 is a part of VS 2008, but the new
tech preview doesn't seem to hurt that isntallation in any
way as far as I can tell in early testing. In any case, the
part you're probably most interested in - the part that
includes mobile device syncing - is still not available but
will be available as a tech preview or beta in a few months.
I'm looking forward to it myself.

--
Ginny Caughey
Device Application Development MVP


"Harry Simpson" <harry.simpson (AT) phgt (DOT) net> wrote in message
news:%232amejcQIHA.4684 (AT) TK2MSFTNGP02 (DOT) phx.gbl...
I've been looking at the MS Sync Framework today and it
looks like the next best thing in constructing data syncing
between a device and the data on a server. Started to
download the Tech Preview edition and in the instructs it
tells me to uninstall any other sync bits including Sync
Services for ADO.NET. Didn't this come as part of VS2008?
I don't want to mess up VS2008. Is this MS Sync Framework
a great thing?
Lost in the technical woods again....
Harry


























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